Preview Build Discussion => Preview Build Discussion => Resolved Issues => Topic started by: Rob-kayak on October 07, 2019, 07:22:12 PM

Title: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: Rob-kayak on October 07, 2019, 07:22:12 PM
Successfully installed on my first computer... which, has many, many, more programs running.

Windows 7 Professional addition.

Second computer... after many re-installs...
extensive research... on ntdll.dll file etc etc...
Updating Windows etc etc..
I tried putting different versions of the ntdll.dll file on the second computer etc.. etc...

I ran the Wacups systems reporter and there didn't show any conflicting plugin's and all looked good.. you know the "green" dots vs "yellow and red" ones.

I don't think there is much anybody could tell me at this point.. after all my testing.

So Dr. O... don't go crazy trying to resolve this... nobody else is having this problem.

I try to start Wacup.. occasionally getting splash screen to try update..
and then the notice that it won't start and conflict with ntll.dll
Problem signature:
  Problem Event Name:   APPCRASH
  Application Name:   winamp.original
  Application Version:
  Application Timestamp:   52aa753e
  Fault Module Name:   ntdll.dll
  Fault Module Version:   6.1.7601.24520
  Fault Module Timestamp:   5d673e60
  Exception Code:   c0000005
  Exception Offset:   00031d86
  OS Version:   6.1.7601.
  Locale ID:   1033
  Additional Information 1:   4c0d
  Additional Information 2:   4c0d4d78887f76d971d5d00f1f20a433
  Additional Information 3:   4c0d
  Additional Information 4:   4c0d4d78887f76d971d5d00f1f20a433

I've tried the latest two versions.
tried installing with the original file removed from the computer.. etc..

I didn't try installing in "safe mode" but I did try running in the "computer's" safe mode,
and also tried msconfig to start computer with fewer programs running.

Just throwing this topic out there.
from all that I have learned.. a of conflict with another driver.. .

the unfortunate situation is that the computer I want it on is my "media" computer for playing music and videos.
Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: dro on October 07, 2019, 08:21:46 PM
ntdll.dll is a generic entry point into a lot of the OS handling so replacing that is really not a good idea & usually if there was a crash report generated then that will give me a better attempt at determine what issue is going on (there's a few key ones in the new build that I've found to be affecting a lot of people now that I've got a better means to see the crashes that are happening).

If you've got specific copies of the crash reports then I'll look at them (I've probably already seen them if they were able to be auto-submitted via the WACUP crash reporter but I wouldn't know its from you). You can either upload them here or just send them in an email to bugs@getwacup.com.

Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: Rob-kayak on October 07, 2019, 09:56:02 PM
thanks again..
on the problem computer.. the program barely starts.. but a .dmp file is generated.

occurred in both 1.07 and 1.08
file sent by email...
attached file is named:

Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: dro on October 07, 2019, 10:10:03 PM
Got it & just had a look & one other user has had this issue (they ended up using a portable install & it worked) but I'm stumped by why it fails deep within the OS. It happens when its trying to work out the location of the settings folder to use but the failure is within the OS trying to determine security attributes from what I can tell.

One option might be to hard-code handling for the default location from the config to use a different (preferred) OS method & see if that helps. Will try to get a change rolled into the build I'm trying to get finished off at the moment for other stability issues.

Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: Rob-kayak on October 07, 2019, 11:09:41 PM
Well... what do ya know :-)
first time I ever did a "portable"...
just threw in a spare flash thumb drive and installed...
And we have success !

in my many reads about ntdll.dll one person had an issue with a game and they moved it to an external drive and they had success.

I hate to have bothered you with the issue... but glad I did to try the "portable."
Hopefully that helps you investigate the issue for others too.

No hurry to get to the original install issue resolved for me... as I now have a fix if perhaps a large streaming (radio) company moves to "https" and my existing 5.666 starts failing.

Thanks again.
Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: dro on October 08, 2019, 06:38:48 PM
The portable install can be done on a normal drive as well - it just has to be somewhere that allows unrestricted writing of settings into the folder. It also works as it avoids using the OS method that seems to be causing the issue.

I've made the change I'd mentioned for tonight's build so would be appreciated if you can try it out when you can & if it doesn't work then I'll have to try out some other options as 2 confirmed instances of it failing (I think there's one other but that user moved onto something else) means it's got to be more common than I'm knowing about.

Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: Rob-kayak on October 08, 2019, 11:30:35 PM
You have a achieved success !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
with the latest build today.

I dropped in my playlists and podcasts..
and my modified skin Modern ProStak II

I am not sure if I didn't notice it before...
In the Playlist Editor... there is a teeny tiny version of the equalizer flashing.
I may have read here somewhere that is a known issue.. certainly not a "deal" breaker..

Also.. not sure if you have a specific reason.. but when you first install WACUP..
and launch... the default skin appears to be Classic 2x -> Classic Winamp.
It looks great... but there is no "scaling."
So it is rather small on my monitor...
Although... I think most people coming here are not first time Winamp'ers.
So they would know about changing skins and scaling... to adjust their choices.

Congratulations on the success :-)
Thanks again !
Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: dro on October 09, 2019, 02:01:40 AM
The wonders of Windows programming never stops amazing & bemusing me but that's good to know it's been able to start ok in a normal location (i'll have to find & update the other thread where it was reported to see if that's also the case for them).

The vis window in the playlist editor is a known issue as I've not yet worked out what is causing that as part of the transition between winamp's code doing things & my code instead doing it (with the vis drawing still being something I've not tackled yet). It is a beta / preview after all :)

On first run of a new install, there should be a skin selection dialog that allows for selecting between the range of 5 skins that are included by default. the dialog is setup to actually try to force the user to make a choice instead of imposing a default unless using the likes of tabbing navigation at which point it will pre-select the classic skin as that tends to fair better from an accessibility view point.

As for classic skin scaling, that's a whole can of worms as the handling at the moment is still shy of being able to do double-size windows / frames on everything. WACUP does much better than Winamp in that respect as I've added support for the main playlist editor & the generically skinned windows (e.g. the media library window) with the video window the last on that needs to be replaced. Winamp proper just does the main & eq windows. When more of the handling is one by WACUP then I will be looking for classic skins to have some other scaling values as I don't have access to a 4k or a 1440p screen at the moment but I appreciate there is a desire from those using such screens for something that can play better with them.

Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: Rob-kayak on October 09, 2019, 08:56:14 AM
The "skin splash screen" did show up on some install attempts.
On my main computer where install was successful on first attempt.. I can't quite honestly remember if I saw it or not.. it probably did.

On the many attempts on the problem computer it would occasionally show during the crash... on the latest successful install it didn't.. the computer probably had the install "stuck" in memory... whatever..

Over the last few years I would occasionally  come over here and peak at the development..
and finally gave it a go... I'm stoked with the progress.

For the Podcasts... I am not sure if "https" is supposed to be working.. I don't think it is...
I do see an option in the General settings.. for https... I don't think that would apply for my use.

I thought (https was working in Podcasts) but for the one Podcast that requires it...
I still had my Perl script as the link to access that Podcast.
The Perl script I run goes to the actual feed/rss and dynamically gets the page stripping out the "s" .   I mentioned this before.
In Winamp/WACUP , I just point to the perl script "url"..
Certainly not rocket science but it works...

I know https has been an issue for a long time with Winamp... and the generic work around is to "view file info" , strip out the "s" , and manually enter the "url".

I don't know much about "ssl" certificates... and certainly don't know how difficult and or how to implement into Winamp/WACUP... I imagine it's not so simple.

Certainly don't go about tackling the issue on my behalf,
 in your progression of development, as it is not really a problem for me.
If you would like the script for personal use let me know and I will send it to you.

Thanks again.
Have a great day.

Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: quartzdoll on October 09, 2019, 12:31:36 PM

I am not sure if you still have crashing problem with wacup loading. As a previous user of winamp on win-7 i suggest to you install all latest visual c++ runtimes and see if your problem goes away. I did same with old winamp crashing issue.
Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: dro on October 09, 2019, 06:00:48 PM
Rob: If you can let me know the podcast url that's failing then I can look into it & I'd suspect there's something about it (format or even access issues) rather than SSL support not working as 90% of the podcasts I've got in my WACUP installs are HTTPS related.

The options in the preferences are to do with proxy support & the podcast downloading can make use of them but it's primarily down to I take the url, pass it off to libcurl & that then does the majority of the work & mostly succeeds (unlike Winamp's implementation).

quartzdoll: That's not necessarily going to help (especially as the loading issue is resolved) as WACUP ships with the supporting runtime files it already needs to save having to install it globally & to make it much easier to generate a contained portable install. Also the loading failure was an issue with an OS api being used & the only time that installing the runtimes is for 3rd party plug-ins where the developer has not accounted for it which will just prevent the dll from loading rather than causing the process to crash :)

Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: Rob-kayak on October 09, 2019, 07:31:17 PM
This the feed url I have been using... it still works.. non https

I get the files loaded into the Podcast "playlist".

But "file" urls look like the one below...

If you take out the "s" in http they load... thus my perl script.

They changed a few months ago to the "https" in the mp3
I just double checked on my "good" computer.. so it's the same thing.

No worries...
Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: dro on October 09, 2019, 07:42:01 PM
Oh, are you're trying to play the entries as a stream rather than downloading locally & then playing it ?

As the downloading locally is fine whether it's HTTPS or HTTP from a quick test of the feed. It's only if trying to play the stream url that you'll hit the issues with the MP3 decoder which is on the hit list to resolve but hasn't yet been done.

I guess I can try to force any HTTPS url to HTTP if in_mp3 is going to play it as an interim workaround until in_mp3 is eventually replaced (it's a bit of a pain as it's relied upon quite a few things especially streaming) & the worst case is you still don't have a working stream url to play.

Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: Rob-kayak on October 09, 2019, 08:17:40 PM
Yes... live streaming...
But... it looks like that is the only https I am having problems with.
Yes.. I could download.. just not stream that particular podcast

I hadn't looked at my other podcasts that have https in the URL.. because they worked.

I just didn't look at what worked, only the broken Podcast.... and as I had read in the Winamp forums about https streaming or download or whatever and that it was an issue... ie: copy the url, strip the "s", put manually in.

Thusly... that is I just checked other podcast and some have https .
And they are working...

The problem podcast streaming... the error occurs as a "Error syncing to stream" and it times out.
Yet, as you stated... downloading works.

Could be something on their end... not Wacup.

Sorry for any inconvenience.
Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: Rob-kayak on October 09, 2019, 08:38:53 PM
Also... just a little side note..
Some of my podcasts I've had for years.. same rss/link.
And I am sure they didn't start out with https in file mp3 url..
Yet now they do and work.

Or I would have certainly taken notice...
It was just that particular one that I had my focus on.. not looking at what was working.

Thanks again as always.
Title: Re: NTDLL.DLL crash on load (the other computer).
Post by: dro on October 09, 2019, 09:17:18 PM
The feed url can be the same & that will keep working fine but it's the cotents within that can & will change with time. Ideally a feed should offer HTTP urls if it's from a HTTP feed & HTTPS from a HTTPS feed url but there's a general shift to just providing HTTPS urls irrespective as most clients support it.

Playing the feed entries as a stream is going to always fail with HTTPS urls as the solution that in_mp3 (the MP3 decoder & stream handling plug-in) uses doesn't cope correctly with HTTPS & so it'll fail. Nothing you're doing wrong, just the age of that (annoyingly) important plug-in means it's less compatible with the modern age than would be liked.

Anyhoo, I've added the HTTPS -> HTTP change to the todo list as it shouldn't be too much of an issue to get it done.